CIA r Approved For Release 2000/08/08: !"~ !RDPb)S 7.06-71001600420001-9 IAGPA-F-SD MEMORANDUM FOR RECORD 18 October 1983 SUBJECT: CENTER LANE Interview Summary - HU-1041/8307/01 (U) 1. (S/CL-3/NOFORN) On 120900 October 198: interviewed concerning Area "H", a building buildings with which source was familiar. sponsor had provided geographic coordinates a photograph of the buildings,, and a map relative location (see Incl 1). , source #01 was within a group of The project 8307 of the buildings, SGIA showing their 3. (U) A transcript of the interview was prepared including a narritive explanation of Source's drawing (see Incl 2). 4. (U) A DA Form 341 (Agent Report) was prepared for the sponsor. Attached to the report as EXHIBIT I was a copy of Source's drawings. This report related the salient points of the interview. (see Incl 3). 3 Incl as NOTRCEE! FREDERICK H. ATWATER CPT, MI OPS/TNG Officer CLASSIFIED BY: CDR, INSCOM DECL: OADR C AY App"wed- TO'8 CIA-RM401ff 0420001-9 SG1C Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIA-RDP96-00788ROO1600420001-9 Next 1 Page(s) In Document Exempt Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIA-RDP96-00788ROO1600420001-9 PCOnC;g Approved For Release 20OU1 MOO 4j&;LWW-jU7 88 ROO 1600420001-9 TRANSCRIPT HU-1041/8307/01 #66: This will be a CENTER LANE Interview for 0900 hours 12 October 1983. Relax and concentrate now. Relax and focus your attention on the building you know as area "H". Focus now on the upper floors of area 11H11 and describe your perceptions to me. #01: ... Get a vault...entry..large steel door...inside is another door with bars. .... See racks of ... multiple booklet packs ... stacked on the racks. ......... Sense that these are made there, ... tissue paper wrappings, polished wrapping paper, waxed. Paper's sealed ... on the edges of the books. ..... Just surrounded by books, ... small ... Sense nobody is here. #66: Okay, examine one of the packets of books. #01: ..... Very thin paper, then it's sealed with paper .... hard cardboard exterior. #66: Okay now, tell me about the packets themselves. #01: 1 see ... two tacks of six, three stacks of two in each stack of six. Two stacks of six books, bound with a ... bound with a .... plastic of some kind, ... some kind of plastic. #66: Now these, do I understand that the books are packed in two's or in pairs of some kind? #01: They're face to face, numbers showing on the edge, identical numbers on the'edge. #66: Okay. Are the booklets, these two things that are packed face to face with numbers on the edge, are the two books different in any way? #01: Just a minute, I'll look. ........ See a double column, gray and white with digits super imposed, digits in gray columns are in the white column on the other half, ...and vice-versa, ..but they're the same .... equate to..a..numbers, ..two digit numbers, 00 through 99, ... represent digits or design ahhh ... symbols. #66: Okay do I understand that these are the books themselves, these two books with the same number, Approved For Release 2000108/ots : L;j VWMIROO1 600420001-9 Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIO*6P4Z0f8-8R001600420001-9 are they identical or are they different in some way? #01: ... Difference in their columns,. numbers in first book in gray column is in second book, white column. #66: All right. #01: They're the same numbers. #66: All right. May I summarize then by saying that the information is the same but formatted differently? #01: ... Format's same,..just in different color. #66: All right. Now I'd like to address another area now. #01: Okay. #66: This area you're in seems to have a massive amount of these booklets around you. I'm interested in the process by which these may be sent someplace else and in this process, how many of them are sent at any one time out of this room and how often that occurs? #01: ..Just a minute. ...... See ah bundles in ... metal crates .... bundles of twelve being shipped on a...everyday. See some kind of red characters painted vertically on corner of box. ..Each bundle has..got different characters ....... loaded into a..all metal truck with guards, like armored car. ....... Just a minute. ....... Now I get ... impression of ... once ah ... once a year these are sent to each receiving point. Certain areas are different months. They always go in ah.. silver and metal boxes with red paint on the side, horizontal, always loaded with guards into armored type van. See a ... air transport used .... receipt system, but only signing for metal boxes. ...Always shipped one way, never returned. #66: Okay, I have a question for clarification. #01: Okay. #66: You originally said something about daily, and then you said that once a year these crates are shipped to any particular designation. Can I assume that Approved For Release 2000/08/08: CIA-R 01600420001-9 2 orftnn- Approved For Release 2000/08/08: CIA*; Igf MIZIBROO1600420001-9 I to mean that the activity of shipping at area "H" is a daily activity but that one silver box goes to any particular location only once a year? #01: Just a minute. ...... That's correct in most cases. ... See a..now and then seem to get deviation.. for some reason. All seem to go in the same direction, ... somewhere extreme north, -mountains. ..... Just get input ... snow and ice and mountains. #66: Okay,return to area 11H11 now. #01: Just a minute . ...... Okay. #66: Okay, are any of these booklets used here in area 11H11 or the immediate vicinity? #01: Um, no. Get a strong service ... feeling, provides service ..elsewhere. #66: Okay. Go to a location where these booklets are used. #01: ..... Okay, very low echelon. #66: Freeing in time, watch the use of a booklet and describe. #01: ..... See a .... special kind of writing ..... hand moving rapidly over paper circling specific symbols,..equivelant number of-the symbol is written from circled area. .... Ah. numbers are punched on a tape,..papers, ..fed into a reader of some kind, ..other side copies what it gets. #66: Break out "other side copies what it gets." #01: Just see hand over circles,..circling numbers. #66: Okay, move back through your procedure here and walk me through step by step how this individual, you know, from the time he picks up one of these things and what he actually physically does, just the taw data what you see him physically do. #01: .... Opens the book, ahh, checks 6 digit number in upper right corner, ...bottom left corner ... reads from paper, characters, circles characters, copies numbers, equating. .... Puts numbers in machine Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIA- 01600420001-9 Approved For Release 2000/08/08 00420001-9 that makes a tape of paper. Puts tape of paper in m, machine which. a ... reads it very f ast. That's all, then it's gone. #66: All right. Return now to present time area 11H11. #01: Okay. #66: All right, looking now at these booklets surrounding you in area 11H11 , ask yourself the question, "where are these books printed?" #01: ... See separate building, low, same area. Get a feeling significant difference between this separate building and function of production and overall feeling of building where books are stored. ...Gone to long, I forgot your question. #66: All right. Describe the area where the books are printed. #01: .... See a ... special kind of machine with starter numbers. 1 don't know what that means, but it's like a master row of numbers that can be changed. Each book is altered (mumble) the master numbers. Each pair of books that is. See more than just few of these machines, big rolls of tissue paper, ... large stamp type machines ..that can drive staples and that cut through thick-paper stacks. #66: All right. Where is this area in relationship with area IIHII? #01: ........ Get an impression it's ..on line with .... current area 11H11 and ..a ah-formation of trees of some kind, trees or stantions or something ... inside 1500 meters--- #66: All right. #01: ---separate fenced area. #66: Okay, return to area 111111 and the booklets again. #01: Okay. #66: Okay. Let's take it more of a physical description. Return to the place what you observed earlier where an individual actually used a booklet and looked at the pages and circled some things on the ages. Approved For Release 2000/08/08: CIA-RD FM00420001-9 4 P91MC11 041. Vlw'k L I Approved For Release 2000/08/ut$ %JjUfJM1#UU788 ROO 1600420001-9 #01: What I see ah ....... see application of water, resolves paper. #66: Okay. Return to area 11H11 and booklets. #01: Okay. #66: 1 have no further questions concerning area 11H11 and the booklets. I'd like now to explore on your own beyond the confines of my questions, remembering that which you perceive so that you may draw it for me later. #01: ...... That's all I got. #66: All right. Approved For Release 2000/08/08: CIA-RDP96-Ot7t"j%, 1420001-9 5 Approved For Release 2000/08/08 -! 88ROO1600420001-9 DRAWING EXPLANATION #01: Okay, Page #1, figure A is a representation of how the twelve double packs of books are stacked prior to being shipped. The twelvepackets representing an annual packet that's delivered on a one time shot, even though they are delivering these packages year round are each different particular target area that's being delivered books or being delivered books on an annual basis. They're in stack of three doubles, six doubles to a side and twelve doubles square. It's not perfectly square either. The double books are identical except for the color change in the columns. #01: Figure B is representation of a silver metal case with a snap on cover and it's wrapped in metal bands and it's got a red seal in the center and red ietters are stenciled vertically on the end of the box. That's how it's actually shipped and that's load into a armored type vehicle with enclosed vehicle. #66: You said there was a receipt type system where ever this box went there was a receipt type system? #01: Yeah, and it's the box and the seal that's worried about, not so much what's inside, as far, as the receipting system goes. #66: Okay, Im have another question that's really off the wall. #01: Okay. #66: Do the people that handle this through the receipt systems of sending this out, do they know what's in the boxes? #01: No, they don't have any idea, they just "go do it boys", you know. #66: Okay. #01: Page #2 is a representation of one of the books with the cover opened. They seem to be bound in hard cardboard covers and what I had before is the silver wrapping or a foil type wrapping,now appears to be more of a plastic type finish, sort Approved For Release 2000/08/08: clA; Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CTIM-WRTUR001600420001-9 of like a Milar, I guess. the book is always circled from upright corner to bottom left corner, going down the page and across to the left from the right side. I give an example of the numbers and symbols. Only dif f erence in the books of a double pair is the color of the columns and that changes from one book to the other. I'm also not sure about the characterizations of the numbers, you know, these are just remote viewing representations of numbers. These are numbers but there also seems to be some symbology there as well. #01: Page #3 is a flow chart, Al and A2 is a selection of a page from the book and data, just some general data. B is where the page in the book is circled a certain way and then a list of numbers that's produced and then those numbers are put on to a spool type and then the type's mounted into some kind of machine. I wrote "passed electrically" but I'm not sure about that, there's something about speed there or time or something that's screwed up and I'm not sure why they would transpose it to a reel tape. But anyway--. F is the list, of numbers that come from the reel and produce circles or numbers and symbols on the page. I just get a production of data out of that and the pages are dissolved in water. #66: Okay, f rom F on it seems like sort of like a mirror image of what's above there. #01: Yeah, (mumble) right. #66: Okay. #01: But B and E are really confusing to me. I can't handle what those are. #66: Okay. Anything else? #01: No, that's all. #66: Okay. UPOCT Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CRWM'UW-8 R001 600420001-9 2 Approved For Release 2000/08f0_P.W%"961=7 8ROO1600420001 L V QQ 0 0 ~ ul V) Approved For Release 2000/08/08 (ft~="ji4+1:600420001-9 N-0 Approved For Release 2000 RWVrjEq U-0ftstIR001600420ge"I Qw Approved For Release 2000/0"F-CV(%RpnqV-% I _"8ROO1600420001-9 --T-7 % k.~ I 4x r% 1-00 Approved For el se 2000,OW[61:LcrA-xDRq,6L-0-07'88 ROO 1600420001-9 R 0 j V Ne 91 14 -cc Q- klk- 4 EA Approved For Release cA IL V D8/08 CIA-RD.P96-.QO .788 ROO 1600420001 -9 Approved For Release*MO/08 0160deOO01-9 /SEGRETRi .1, For use of this form, see FM 30-17(C); AR 381-20; the Proponent agency Is the Office of the Assistant Chief of Staff for Intelligence. NAME Of SUBJECT OR T17LE OF INCIDENT SG1A CLASSIFIED BY: CDR, INSCOM DECL: OADR HU-1041/8307/01, A. REPORT OF FINDOWDS On 12 October 1983, Source concerning activities and material building known to him as Area H. as follows: 2. DATE SUbmITYED 3. CONTROL SYMBOL OR FILE NUMBER Z6-01 was interviewed on the upper floors of the Source stated substantially This was a vault area with a large steel entry door and another door with bars. Inside the vault area were multiple booklet packs stacked on racks. The booklets were made of very thin paper with a hard cardboard exterior and sealed with polished or waxed wrapping paper. The booklets were packed in pairs face to face with numbers (not further identified) on the edge. The booklets in the pairs were different only in the colors of the columns, white/gray vice gray/white, inside the booklets . The two digit numbers 00 through 99 (not further identified) and symbols (not further identified) in the booklets were the same. These booklets were printed in a building approximately 1500 meters front Area H in a separate fenced area. In this building was a special kind of machine (not further identified) with starter numbers (not further identified) This "master row of numbers" was changeable and each pair of booklets was altered (not further identified) by and/or with "the master numbers." The building contained many of these machines, rolls of tissue paper, and large stamp type machines which looked like they could drive staples and cut. through thick paper stacks. Metal boxes or crates containing twelve pairs of booklets (see drawing 1) were shipped from Area H to "very low echelon" (riot further identified) locations on an annual basis. "Now WARN ING NOTICE: SENSITIVE INTELLIGENCE SOURCES AND METHODS INVOLVED NOT RELEASABLE TO FOREIGN NATIONALS (continued) 5. TYPED NAME AND ORGANIZATiON Of WECIAL -SKCI;~[ izim-f, 8ROO 1 60041106TW-l" "NO/083 R001 Approved For Releasel EGREWT78' 60MO01-9 AGENT REPORT Chief of Staff for Intolligonce. For wm of this f9rm, see I'M 30-17(C); AR 381-20; the proponent agency Is th* Office of the Assistant N,*Mf OF SUMOrT ON 117LE 07 tMCIDEW SG1A DATE SUSMITIED 3, CONTROL SYMBOL OR Fit[ NUMSER HU-1041/8307/01 4. WORT Of rMINGS and then" there were deviations (not further identified) from this annual procedure . Some of the booklets were shipped to an area of mountains covered with snow and ice in the extreme north (not further identified). Shipment of the metal boxes involved the use of guards, a receipt system, and ground and air transport. Shipment of the booklets was always one way; they were not returned to Area 11. "Very low echelon" personnel who used the booklets followed a prescribed procedure (see drawings 2 and 3). First they checked a "six digit number in the upper right corner/bottoin left corner" (not further identified) of a page in a booklet. Second, they read characters from a paper (not further identified); third, they circled characters (not further, identified, but presumably characters from the unidentified paper) on the page in the booklet; fourth, they copied character equivalant numbers (not further identified) on a piece of paper; fifth, they placed these numbers into a r,,Iachine "that makes a tape of paper" ( not f urther identified). in the f inal step, they placed this "tape of paper" in a machine which "reads it very fast" (not further identif ied) .This machine may have been an electronic tratisaiission/coi-~imuriic,--At ions device .The "other side" (not fUtther identified, but possibly the other side of a comi;iunications link) copied what it received in a reverse ordered procedure (see F, G and 1-1 of drawing 3). After pages in the booklets were used they were destroyed by disolving them in water. Source provided no further amplifying information concerning SUBJECT during this interview. Attached hereto as EXIIII31T I are drawings provided by Source 't'4-A-M-K-F -A- -t-A-V, OgGAp4jZAjION OF SPECIAL AGENT SIGNATURE OF SPECIAL AGENT Intialoffic*: *U.S. Government Pr Al 01600420001-9 AApp k T _V-W-NTZAW~f. 4" T11% - VZIXW~ M=4~ "A. Approved For Release 2000/Qr4-Ad-& er'""OJ788 ROO 1600420001-9 US ARMY INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY COMMAND 4 XHIBIT E COVER SHEET SG1A SUBJECT: FILE NUMBER: ,u-1041/8307/01 PREPARING UNIT: AGENT REPORT DATED: DESCRIPTION: TO r, mzio NATIONas Eu"' R ET Approved For Release 2000/08/08 CIA-RD[-Rkf8jTROO16OO42OOO1-9 -Ris, Approved For Release 2000/09'/0l 8 - F66-60788 ROO 1600420001 -9 /u, .C) X QQ Ck CI V) Approved For Release 2000/ WR 1600420001-9 bA~-*WOMJM001 600420001-9'1 Approved For Release 2000/0~68~-" 4. Q, ~I e Approved For Release 2000/0 tj -tff-t=01600420001-9 Approved For Release 2~6 9R/ -A rwLArRDPQ6 0 788RO01 600420001-9